Audio file of the episode is available on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Video file is available on YouTube.
Transcript
Tobi Nussbaum: Hi there, my name is Tobi Nussbaum. I’m the CEO of the National Capital Commission and welcome to Capital Stories. In today’s episode, we’re going to talk about the Core Area Plan, something that is important in the NCC’s planning framework and something our board of directors just passed this past June. With me today is Patrick Bunting, who really was the architect of leading us through this plan, which was a refresh from our 2005 plan, if memory serves. So, Patrick, welcome to Capital Stories.
Patrick Bunting: Hi Tobi, thank you. Happy to be here.
Tobi Nussbaum: Great. So maybe just to start, can you tell us a little bit about 2005 to 2025. What has changed in the core area in the 20 years between the last time we took a look at this and why was it important for us to update the plan?
Patrick Bunting: Well, a lot’s changed. Twenty years is a long time. So, if you kind of think back to that period, that’s before the pandemic. Going further back, it’s before kind of Truth and Reconciliation Calls to Action. Federal Accessible Canada Act has come into play. Business has changed. Sustainability and environmental conversations have changed. Equity and diversity conversations have changed. So, a lot has taken place in that 20-year time span. And as much as it was a forward-looking plan in 2005, a lot of those things need to be refreshed. So that’s typical that these plans get kind of reviewed and updated on a ten-to-twenty-year basis. And we were due to revisit this plan.
Tobi Nussbaum: Makes sense. Now, core area, I understand it. I’ve been looking at the briefings that you’ve offered over the last number of years on this. But can you describe to our viewers and listeners, when we talk about the core area of the capital, what are we talking about?
Patrick Bunting: So, it’s a large area. Includes two downtowns of Ottawa and Gatineau. And it’s about nine square kilometres. So, just in terms of the landmass that’s covered here in the west, it goes all the way from LeBreton Flats on the Ottawa side to Rideau Hall. And then it includes all of l’Ile de Hull in the Gatineau context as well. So obviously, it includes a lot of really iconic symbolic places, Parliament Hill, Rideau Hall, the Supreme Court of Canada, as well as a lot of our galleries, museums and so forth. And it’s just a really culturally significant and important place with a lot of history.
Tobi Nussbaum: We are sitting here along the shorelines of the Ottawa River at the home of the Royal Canadian Geographical Society. Are we just on the eastern edge of the core area? Or are we outside the core area?
Patrick Bunting: We are inside the core. We’re just about if we went another maybe a kilometre and a half that way, we’d be outside the core. But this is within the core. And yeah, what an amazing view where this is a really unique area. We have about 34 kilometres of shoreline that are inside the core.
Tobi Nussbaum: That’s great. Now, I’m curious, you and I know that the core area plan falls underneath our master planning framework, which is the Plan for Canada’s Capital. And is this idea of having planning frameworks for what the Capital will look like in 10 or 20 years? Is that something that other capitals have as well? Are we unique in that? Or do we find if we look around the world that other capitals do something similar?
Patrick Bunting: I think a lot of capitals do this type of planning work. I think the NCC as a planning agency is unique in the sense that we are also the owners and stewards of a lot of lands. But it’s typical for all cities, and especially major capitals, to have plans that are long term, forward looking, and are kind of charting a course towards what they hope to become and make sure that they preserve the most important characteristics of their cities.
Tobi Nussbaum: So, talking about the plan, I know there are three big moves that have been identified in the plan. Can you talk a little bit about what those three big moves are and why they’re important?
Patrick Bunting: Yep. So maybe I’ll start by just going back to how we came up with those three big moves.
Tobi Nussbaum: Great.
Patrick Bunting: So early on in the process, we looked at what had been done in 2005, took stock of the most important pieces of that, and also looked at the important kind of character of this study area. So there’s thousands of years of Algonquin cultural significance, the Algonquin traditional territory, all of the landmark sites that we have here. And that sort of started to shape the conversation about what’s important and what do we need to change. So, in the process, we started with going out to the communities, putting out pop-up kiosks, doing public consultations, workshops, and so forth to identify what are the main thrusts of this plan. What is it that we want to build upon? Because we are starting from 125 years of capital building. So, it’s not a matter of starting from scratch, it’s a matter of building and continuing that legacy. So, the three big moves that came out through those discussions, the first one is “turn towards the water.”
Tobi Nussbaum: Appropriate.
Patrick Bunting: Appropriately. We have an amazing richness of rivers. I can hear the waterfall right next to me that’s rushing. This is a really, really unique characteristic of our capital and of this city. And therefore, that was really a key part… is how do we bring people to the water? How do we activate those shorelines? How do we preserve the ecological integrity of the waterways and the riverfronts? But to create more opportunity, more interest, more services and potential for people to enjoy and get onto the water as well. So not just how it is perceived from the land, but what can you do on the waterways and how do they connect back to important places? So, turn towards the water is number one. Number two is “make great places.” So here we’re talking about creating destinations, capitalizing on all the amazing landmarks and cultural resources that we have here in the region. So, as much as honouring and preserving our UNESCO world heritage sites and heritage buildings, but then also bringing new services, amenities, commercial activations, partnerships that can infuse life and vitality into those spaces. So, a good example of this, something that we heard really strongly from the public, is the NCC’s Bistro projects in our Capital parks are hugely successful, very much appreciated. And those are the types of things that we could see continuing to be brought forward as opportunities in different contexts with different partners. And lastly is “make connections.” So, creating connections is really about the core area being at the centre of this whole region and the idea that we have waterways that connect us to Montreal, Temiskaming, Kingston, Maniwaki, and on top of that also extensive pathway networks. We have 220 kilometres of capital pathways throughout this area that connect to Gatineau Park and the Greenbelt and they all converge on the core area. So, it’s about tying those things together, making sure that we have good public transit, active mobility systems, and that those are opportunities to get us to these destinations and major tourist sites.
Tobi Nussbaum: Great. So going from the macro, which are the three big moves, and drilling down a little bit and understanding what that means in concrete terms on a micro level, what would you say, let’s say in 10 years time, so we’re in 2035, and hopefully you’re still at the NCC, Patrick, at that point, and you’re reflecting on the previous decade. What would you like to have seen happen in the time between 2025 and 2035 which would show that the Core Area Plan was a successful guide to some of those more micro interventions?
Patrick Bunting: So, I think one of the biggest measures of success will be more people… more people doing things downtown in Gatineau, in Ottawa, making sure that our downtowns are strong and resilient and a place where people want to live and they want to work. So, I think this is as much a challenge for… it’s something that, actually, we inherited from the past and we need to look at really what’s the opportunity that we have today to change some of the patterns. So, in 2005, one of the criticisms was that downtown is… there’s not a lot of people living there, there’s a lot of federal functions, office spaces and so forth, so after five o’clock, it’s a little bit sparse, there’s not a lot of things going on. That has sort of shifted with the pandemic and different work patterns and so forth. There’s opportunity, I think, right now, to bring more residents downtown, which then stimulates the business sectors and also provides the density that we need to have animation and commercial offerings within the beautiful spaces that we are managing and planning for. So, I think one of those things is more people doing more things and making sure that there’s a wide variety of opportunities, more equitable options for people of all ages and abilities to really use the core area and appreciate its qualities.
Tobi Nussbaum: So, if I were to go back then to the three big moves, for the NCC that means figuring out ways on NCC lands to develop housing, to think about ways that we can contribute to greater density in the downtown core; it means offering better access to the water, it means creating even more great spaces and then making it easy for people to get there.
Patrick Bunting: Exactly, yep. It’s all part and parcel, so these all come together. Conversions from office space to residential, there’s a lot of things that are shifting right now. We’re seeing major infrastructure projects coming for public transit, bridges that are being replaced. These types of things are kind of moments in time that we can capitalize on. So, if we’re clear on our goals and our objectives, the values that we’re really trying to work towards, then we can seize these opportunities to say, hey, this is a possibility that wasn’t present before we changed this piece of infrastructure, but now we could reimagine it in a new way.
Tobi Nussbaum: Yeah, I think that makes sense and I think the timing has been great. I mean the Board is approving this in June 2025 in the context of, really, an attempt by both cities and the NCC and many other partners to think about downtown revitalization post COVID-19, and so, I imagine that in your discussions with partners… well, you tell me, has there been an openness to this or was this plan in the draft stage and now that it’s finished being treated with enthusiasm by partners? What has been the reaction in the various discussions you’ve had with them?
Patrick Bunting: So far, we’re seeing a lot of alignment actually, there’s a lot of common goals. So, I think there’s an acknowledgement that we all need to work together to be able to achieve something that’s good for the region and that the capital is a city and the city is a capital. That’s part of our main concept for this plan, is that those aren’t mutually exclusive ideas. So, I think we’re seeing a lot of harmonization of different actors. I’ll maybe say that the plan as approved by the Board in June is the first volume and now we’re really starting to get into the deeper level of the conversations about specific sectors: what are the tangible changes and opportunities that reside in each, and the roles and responsibilities amongst different actors? So, the NCC is only one agency amongst many who have a role in this and it’s a conversation that I think is going to continue over the coming year and will require strong partnerships amongst the cities, federal agencies, and the NCC obviously has a strong role in shaping that conversation, as well as approving federal projects on federal lands.
Tobi Nussbaum: Great. I want to go back to the three big moves in the sense of, you know, we’ve talked about making great places, we’ve talked about turning towards the water. I guess we actually should be facing the other way, but if we’re turning towards the water… but I'm looking at the falls so I’ve got a pretty good view. Maybe the third element, the idea of the connections. Let’s talk specifically about transportation and mobility in the Capital. In 10 years’ time, with hopefully more density in the core, with even more great spaces, with even more access to our amazing shorelines and waterways, what does better mobility mean?
Patrick Bunting: I think it’s about having options and there’s not going to be one solution for everyone. So, I think, when we think about making sure that the city itself, and the downtown in particular, being walkable and dense and having a lot of opportunity in a compact space, that’s the start point. Then there’s the idea of people coming to that centre point. So there’s also the regional mobility network in terms of public transit to make sure that people can access the core, in and out of the core, but also making sure that there’s specific solutions for specific needs. So, another thing that’s come out is the idea of… wouldn’t it be great to be able to get to Gatineau Park and we have a shuttle service for that—but what about Rideau Hall? What about the Kichi Zībī Mīkan parkway? There’s other spaces that are outside of the core, but that are essentially really great destinations. So it’s about connecting those pieces together and potentially coming up with different ways to connect adjacent areas. I think the waterways themselves is a really underutilized potential. So, the idea of expanding upon a water taxi or aquabus system, connecting different waterfront nodes and activation points—that’s something that I think can really be leveraged in the future.
Tobi Nussbaum: I think that’s right, and when I think about 2035 in 10 years’ time and I think about mobility, one of the dreams that the NCC has set out is: Could there be a tram loop that goes around Confederation Boulevard? So, from Laurier in Gatineau across the Portage Bridge along Wellington and back over by then what will be the new Alexandra Bridge. I don’t know if it will be renamed or not at that point… and so mobility in terms of encouraging and catalyzing more movement within the core. I think about things like the Centre Block project, which should be done by 2035. I think about projects like the Cliff Street heating plant which has now… which will have when it opens… amazing accessibility from the escarpment down to the water level. I think about the fact that we opened this past spring Kìwekì Point and Westboro Beach, and so we’ve got these new great places. So, I get excited about the idea that the core area could be even more dynamic, even more interesting, lots of great places with the density that I think you’re hoping to see in the plan. That goal of having more people be able to enjoy that from a closer distance would also be great. So that’s my vision. What am I missing? Are there other pieces that you would add in Patrick’s dream of 2035? Are there other elements of the core that you would want to see or that you get excited about in thinking through it?
Patrick Bunting: Well no… and you’ve touched on a lot of them. I think part of this is we’re setting a long-term vision. So, this is, you know, we’re imagining the capital mid-century, 2050, and beyond. We have some ideas that might take a hundred years to realize, but it’s really this idea of, we’re building on what’s happening right now, and we don’t really know exactly the full potential of that until we take that first step, and then there’s new things that get unlocked. So, I think a great example of that is Lady Grey Drive, the potential to re… kind of imagine that as a pedestrian promenade space with new waterfront activation. And then obviously a lot of excitement this year about Kìwekì Point opening. The photos are fantastic. Everyone’s excited. We’re seeing that on social media right now. But where does that connect to next? And that’s where those ideas start to link together through time. So, we’re at the Rideau Falls right now. There’s the potential for the Rideau to Rideau… kind of continuity of this entire shoreline to be transformed through time. So I think it’s this idea of, we’ve gone the first kind of initial steps and then we look for those connections and that’s where all these three big moves really work together… is, turning towards the water, creating these great places, building some destinations, reasons to go, places to visit and then linking them together, and those links will come through time. So the mobility and the destinations are really part and parcel with each other.
Tobi Nussbaum: I want to talk just for a minute about Gatineau because there tends to be, probably due to Parliament Hill and due to the fact that the City of Ottawa is a larger metropolitan area, maybe sometimes less attention paid on Gatineau, but I feel like the plan does a good job in ensuring that Gatineau is considered. It’s certainly part of the core area, as you talked about earlier. I know there are plans to rehabilitate Jacques-Cartier Park after the new bridge is in place.
Patrick Bunting: Yep.
Tobi Nussbaum: And I know there’s lots of talk about how Ruisseau de la Brasserie, Brewery Creek, can be utilized to better improve the public realm and to think about housing in that context too. Do you think there is a way for us to do even more to integrate Gatineau into the core area, and does the plan offer some ways that we can do that?
Patrick Bunting: Yeah, I think… so right behind us, we have Jacques-Cartier Park on the opposite shore here. So again, if we think of the waterway as a connecting space as opposed to something that separates the two cities, I think that in and of itself brings both of them to the table. Obviously, two different cities, two different municipal contexts, different objectives for both cities, but a lot of the… again, commonality. I think everyone wants two strong downtowns and how can we build connections from the public spaces that are potentially federal waterfronts towards the downtown. So that’s part of the context. I think what we’re looking to do really is to give people cues and indications of what’s available… because I think sometimes there’s this kind of separation between public space, federal spaces and private or kind of municipal spaces, and at times it’s about rethinking this boundary effect that happens between land ownership or agencies. So, if we can really lean into the patterns of our city that… making sure that streetscapes are cohesive and connected and when you get to the end of a great street, you’re in a great park and that great park leads you to great waterfront. Those are the kinds of things that are going to really start to stitch it together. So I think the Gatineau context is actually extremely exciting in the sense that we have huge amounts of beautiful waterfront park spaces there. Again, probably missing activation, probably missing specific services and amenities for proper events to be held in those spaces. So that’s part of the program that this plan is bringing forward.
Tobi Nussbaum: Yeah, and speaking of events, I think the other thing that we would hope for in the future, certainly in a ten-year time frame, is a new major event centre at LeBreton Flats and I know the owner of the Ottawa Senators, Michael Andlauer, has talked about an interest in really trying to increase the fan base for the hockey team, but also, you can imagine for a major event centre, whether it’s concerts or other activities, really trying to create a draw from both sides of the river, and I wonder if LeBreton Flats and the very ambitious plans we have for that area, along with Zibi, and along with other things that are happening, including the central public library, are also going to help with that notion of using the river, as you say, of not a way of separation, but a way of joining the capital. So LeBreton Flats I assume is also in the core area and lots of exciting things coming there too.
Patrick Bunting: For sure. And the LeBreton Master Concept Plan is a great template, so the Core Area Plan is sort of reaffirming that, but looking at how does it fit into its broader context. So, obviously the William Commanda Bridge is a great connection right now between Ottawa and Gatineau—that’s again in that same vicinity. If there’s new transit coming from Gatineau into the downtown and core, that’s an opportunity to bring, you know, Gatineau residents into these event spaces and so forth. So, all of this is really at the core area level about looking at what are the different pieces on the playing board and how do they connect with each other and are we missing anything? That’s the question that we’re kind of keeping in mind throughout this whole process. Have we covered it all off, and as we move into each of these sectors to study them in more detail, how do we take the goals, the principles, and the concept that we’ve established and apply that to each place to really make sure that we’re hitting all of our baseline measurements? And that’ll be the exciting kind of opportunity heading forward is… what does that look like and what does that feel like? Then we’re going to get into the design of these spaces and really start to see projects emerge that are in keeping with those aspirations.
Tobi Nussbaum: Well, I think that’s great… I think that’s a great summary, you’ve really described, I think, the aspiration, the fact that this is a framework… lots to do both on the demonstration plans and ultimately the implementation. I’m excited, I’m optimistic about how the Core Area Plan is going to lead us into a more inspiring Capital not, just as you say, in the ten-year time frame, but even looking out further. So thank you for all the work you did on the Core Area Plan, Patrick you and your team, and thanks for joining me today on Capital Stories.
Patrick Bunting: Thank you, Tobi. I really appreciate this.
Tobi Nussbaum: See you later.